This is an anonymous post from an Elpha member.

What’s a reasonable amount of extra work required to get a promotion?

Luanna53·Apr 30, 2023

I'm an IC, about middle-of-the-road in terms of pay grade. Been working in this field for almost 10 years.

I got asked by my boss' boss' boss to take on a huge project, one that has major visibility by all our top customer accounts, not to mention our CIO. The project span is roughly 2.5-3 months.

My boss' boss told me in our last 1:1 that I should request feedback from everyone I work with on this project, to help "build a case for a promotion." I feel a little agitated about this... isn't the work alone enough? I'm putting in 12 hour days... days with up to 12 mtgs a day, including with customers, which isn't part of my job description at all. Is her ask reasonable?

Joy122·Apr 30, 2023

That definitely sounds like overwork to me. Why is it building a case for promotion AFTER the big project to "prove yourself"? If they already think that you're the right person to take on this big project and putting it in your hands...haven't they already determined you're the ideal one to work on it? Could they possibly be trying to take advantage of your effort as much as they can and pushing the 'incentive' down the road for as long as they can, which is very common for companies to just string along workers with a vague carrot-on-a-stick. Negotiation is about leverage, power....who has more power in this situation?Take a moment to think about yourself only and not the benefit to the company. Look at this situation from your own potential benefit, how does it help you and your career? How much work will it take from you to complete this project in the timeline (3 months - is that an accurate timeline based on the work or is it potentially one of those projects that's vastly underestimated and will end up taking way longer based on all the requirements and constraints...which they can then use as a extended timeline on promotion for once its 100% completed?)Do you have leverage to push for a promotion before taking it on? Also what monetary % increase do you get from the promotion + is it worth the extra work? Huge % salary increases are really rare and usually bigger pay bumps come from job jumping to new and better offers.Consider these points and what you really get from this "opportunity" and if deserves to be called that...you have 10 years experience, and if they've already determined you are the ideal person to take on this project, they are asking for your time + effort + specialized skills + experience, and now you get to determine the price for that...if they can't pay the 'price' (promotion/pay increase), or at least something upfront, how much can you trust their willingness to promote you later once this is all completed?

Luanna53·May 03, 2023

This gives me a lot of food for thought. I tend to be a “yes” person first, then I’ll figure out exactly how later. I wind up making a lot of sacrifices (sleep, health, time with my daughter and husband). I like that you mention power, as well as project duration. We are already very far along, but there is now talk of extending the life of this team and our efforts. I’ve set up a meeting with the executive who appointed me this role. Thank you for the wind underneath my wings!!

AnnMarie·May 01, 2023

It might be worth having a conversation with your boss about what the promotion criteria are for your role and what the process is for achieving that promotion. As an example, the requirements for your next role might explicitly state "has managed a project of X size". If that's the case and your team is investing in you to give you that exact experience, then they might be doing you a favor. The process might also be a panel evaluation for associates where they might need an "explanation" to sign off on the next level!

Luanna53·May 03, 2023

Very good points! I’ve only been with this company for about a year, and it’s much larger than other companies I’ve worked for. I will inquire about this in my next 1:1 with her. Thank you!

lauriekuhn·May 01, 2023

They are asking you to capture details that will get you to the next level. The work is never enough, the story and data is the case. And it can be super tricky to find the balance. It sounds like there is too much on your plate. I suggest talking with your manager to remove some of your less visible and critical work in the near term to help you have balance and succeed.

Luanna53·May 03, 2023

Agree fully on the importance of the story and the data. How to weave that together? What data points best reflect the work I’m doing? That is tough, especially when I’m overworked… I should recruit my manager to help remove less-critical work. Thing is, I don’t think he understands the relationships that underly some of the projects? Though, my work quality is likely suffering right now anyway…

lauriekuhn·May 03, 2023

Want to set up some time to chat through both things? If so the best email to coordinate is [email protected]

Larae90·May 02, 2023

Unfortunately the peer reviews and the way the project is "sold" by your manager and their manager is what will help you get the promotion. The work matters but it also needs to be positioned the right way and have the right kind of support. From your peers you will probably need a green light from someone that works at the level you want to get to so invest in those relationships.

Roxanne111·May 02, 2023

There are some things within your control and some things that are not. 12 hour days are not sustainable. But no one will come to you and ask you to work less, if you had a great boss, they might suggest it but WLB is ultimately yours to control. If they are setting expectations of workload that requires 12 hour days - it's time to have a serious talk. If they think you're good enough to lead such a project, they certainly don't want to burn you out in the process. 12 meetings a day - also unsustainable. I've led a crazy project like this, what I learned is that I had to block out my day to get my tasks done, eat a lunch, truly take some time to decompress before I commuted up the stairs from my basement office to my home life.Don't say "not my job" it's never going to shine well on you. Every opportunity to work on another side of the business only makes you more rounded in the field. Even if you don't think your soft skills/customer discussions matter- I bet you that the higher ups see you as an asset. I've been told coding is not the hard part of the job, it's the communication... and almost a decade into my career in this field I tend to agree. Is the promotion worth the extra responsibility? If you really want more money, it's almost always better to switch companies. Getting feedback from peers is important - your skip level cannot see all aspects of your work, it is important and great advice. Usually this happens in a formal annual review process but if you are looking for a promotion, it's also a worthy time to ask your peers to consider your work and support you on this endeavor. Ask them for feedback, act on it, then ask them for a written review.

EmilyLakin·May 04, 2023

+1 to the poster below that said to have a convo with your boss about what the promotion criteria are for your role, what the process is for achieving that promotion, (and I'll add) what you would need to demonstrate with this project to fulfill that expectation. You can also say, "to take this on I'll need to de-prioritize some of the other additional work I've taken on like x, y, and z. What would you suggest I focus on?" Or you can suggest focus areas instead!